A new album, a new purpose perhaps. Imhotep reporter Andreas Aubert talked to Daniel Svensson about live, life, the music obviously and how the recording was different compared to the previous albums.
The new album “A Sense of Purpose” is released the 4th of April in Europe. Drummer Daniel Svensson was in Oslo early February to promote the album. The album has been sent as a so-called “watermarked promo” to the media. This means that if it leaks to the net, it can be traced.
“ “Come Clarity” was put on the net two months prior to release. Now it is two months prior to release, and luckily it has not leaked yet”, Daniel says happily.
Prior to the interview I listened a good deal to the album. I enjoyed it, and especially the first two songs seemed very energetic and representative for the sound of In Flames. Later on the album I felt the band is going in many different directions, and that it is a varied album.
“Yes, it is truly a diverse album. The fast stuff is really fast, the melodic is very melodic. It is extreme in all aspects. But it does not feel like there is a split – it is a very homogenous album. You can really hear that all songs are taken from this album, and not from different albums.”
a successful experiment
The song “The Chosen pessimist” is more in the vein of alternative rock – experimental stuff somewhat outside your signature sound. Daniel confirms that, but says that this mostly goes for that particular song, which is eight minutes long.
“That was an experiment right from the beginning. We usually write songs in “pop-format”: verse, chorus, verse, chorus, bridge, chorus. With this song we dropped these frames altogether. We just saw how the song developed, without caring about any rules. And the end result was so good, that we decided to include it on the album.”
Did you write other songs, which did not work out well enough to be included?
“No, this is the first time we have had four songs which did not end up on the album. Three of them come as bonus tracks on singles. And the last one will be a Japan bonus. So we recorded 16 songs, out of which 12 songs are included on the European edition of the album. This is the first time we had time to experiment with a song. On the other albums it has been more like “fuck, we need one more song”, and we have worked really hard to get that last one. We have also had more experimental songs, such as “Metaphor”, from the “Reroute…”-album, where we play acoustic and Anders is singing clean, and we also use some violins. But that one was meant to be included from the beginning. So this is the weirdest song we have done. It was not like it had to be included, we had enough songs, but it turned out so well we rather left out other songs.”
We then talk about the process of writing songs. Daniel tells me they tried to write new material already prior to the “Come Clarity” tour. They even bought recording equipment to bring on the tour bus, to work with new material on the road.
“We tour for such a long time with each album, and we do not want to have too much time between each album so that people do not lose the interest. But it did not work out at all to write on the tour bus. I think there were one or two riffs written in a month. The first riff was written late last spring. We work best when we are under pressure, when we have decided to have a new album ready at a fixed date. Then the ideas start appearing. The album was written between the end of the spring and the fall. Bjørn and Jesper, the guitarists, write the riffs. Sometimes it is just isolated riffs, other times they put together a few riffs as an idea for a song. Some times a chorus-idea can become a verse instead. So even though the tones come from Bjørn and Jesper, we all try to give input and put things together in collaboration.
extensive analysis of each song
This time every song was analyzed quite extensively, with the whole band present. They recorded demos quickly, with simple drum tracks, to get a proper overview of the songs.
“The songs were quite ready when we entered the studio, but we also improvised quite a bit during the recordings – small details on the drums and the guitars. So it is hard to say how long the songwriting process actually was. There are so many different stages of that process, and we usually do not rehearse the songs very much either. We record them in Pro Tools, move the different parts of the song around. “ok, here we got a song”, we make a simple drum track, and later we will record the album. This time we hade our own studio, which we bought recently – IF studios. We had much more time during the recording process as well. Previously it has been “Daniel, now you have to go to the studio in Uppsala. You get ten days to record 14 songs on drums.” “Fuck, that’s cool!” Then I sit there, and perhaps I have no inspiration that day, but I have to record 1.5 songs pr. day. “
He implies that this can be stressful and a certain anxiety can build up.
“But this time I spent a month to record 16 songs on drums. If I had no inspiration, they said “go home, see you tomorrow”. When I came back I heard what was already recorded. “Yeah, this is cool, but this can be changed”. So I could go back, and change fills etc. So a lot of the reason for this album sounding so great and thorough is that we had so much time during the recording. That is part of the reason we are so happy.”
When you record drums, are you usually very certain about exactly what you are going to play?
“Usually, yes. I have the drum patterns for every riff more or less fixed, but all the fills and breaks I usually somewhat improvise during the recording.”
Totally spontaneously?
“This time it was more spontaneous. Previously I have practiced some fills. This time I could be more creative during the recording process. I could stop in the middle of a song, and say “no, I will change this part with something else.” And we could spend two days to record drums for every song – meet and try new things. So that was very important, at least for me, and also for the others, I believe. Even if one has an idea for a song, has recorded it and listened to it sometimes, one may suddenly think “fuck, I will try this instead”. We have not had time for this previously, then we have thought in hindsight “fuck, what if I could have done this instead?” Now we could try all ideas, and we had plenty of time. So this is the most thoroughly prepared album we have ever done.”
Also as a group, in terms of the group process?
“Yes, this is the first album where we have been in the studio all five of us at the same time, all the time. Both with “Come Clarity” and “Soundtrack…”, I first went to the studio in Uppsala by myself, to record the drums. Then guitar and bass was recorded in Gothenburg. Later Anders would go to a different studio to record. This time I would play the drum part to a certain riff, and Anders or Peter would come and listen, and suggest “maybe you can try this instead”? So we gave much more input on each others stuff, there has been a lot of unity, and much more fun. It has been more of a band thing than it has been for a long time. This was the album which was most fun to record, at least since “Reroute…”.”
Anders has his own studio?
“He and Fredrik Nordstrøm had a studio, but the five of us bought out Fredrik. This means that now we have the old Studio Fredman, which has been rearranged and is now called IF studios, which we own together. Anders previously owned half of it. “
an unorthodox ending
I find the ending on the second song, “Disconnected”, to be very cool. It ends with the drums doing some strange stuff, alone. Dainel agrees, and tells that it was improvised. Was there some sense of humour about it?
“No, not humour. We had no ending to the song. When I and Roberto (which produced the drums) came to the end, we asked Bjørn “How many times is this riff supposed to go?”! It was not decided upon. We did not want to just fade it out, we cannot do that with all the songs. We did not get any answer. I suggested to “retard”, which means that the song is gradually decreasing in tempo. So we retarded on the drums. Later, when the guitars should be added, it did not work to retard to that particular drum groove. Then the drums were left alone. Many songs are just retarded, but with that strange rhythm and the bass line (on the bass drums?), it did not work to add guitars to it. So the drums were left alone. That was quite a “naughty” ending!
Something I can agree with! Daniel says the song is likely to have this ending also when played live. You have used some acoustic guitar on the album. Perhaps more than previously?
“We have some acoustic stuff; one intro, and one part in the middle of a song. I believe it is more, but listen to the album yourself and see. It also depends on how one defines the term acoustic. We have often used acoustic guitars previously, so this is a bit in the vein of old In Flames. It was fitting to those songs. It was not like “now we need to have some acoustic guitar on the album”. It was more like something was missing. We had been wondering, and then decided to try some acoustic guitar.”
The band has used “clean” sound live, but never acoustic guitars. Will they do that on the coming tour?
“We will see. We have not yet decided which songs to play”.
Do you tend to rehearse the new songs intensively prior to tours? Or is it tight from the beginning?
“No, it is not so tight, actually, since we do not rehearse so much prior to the recordings. Later we play through the songs, to see what feels good and which songs sound the best.”
will not be old and pathetic on stage
At least the album title seems a bit hopeful – “A Sense Of Purpose”. In the lyrics, I can sense a constant shifting between frustration and something hopeful, optimism.
“The lyrics are to a great extent that Anders is together with people and writes about ordinary problems etc. The title of the album reflects that now that one (he says one, but I assume he is really meaning we) has become a little older, you ponder about what you want to get out of life etc. Have one found the right path, what will you accomplish before you die etc? To ask questions and gain insight when one gets older. What should you really do?”
I have read in interviews that it can be hard, especially for Anders, to combine his private life with being so much on tour. Do you have any thoughts about how long you will continue?
“That is weird, because we have never gotten that question before, but today I have been asked this in every single interview. It may be because we are starting to get old. It has nothing to do with our private lives, girlfriends and children are used to it. That is not the big problem. It is rather to see how long we can still keep the flame burning and feel that this is nice. Personally I will continue as long as it gets better and better. Though, the day it starts going downhill…
So far we have never had any downhill periods in our career. But if one day, one feels that it is starting to stagnate, one should perhaps make sure whether it is right to continue or not. I do not think we will quit as long as we feel that we can perform better than we have done previously, and that things is still going better for us. But you should not go on stage as old men and look pathetic either. However, that is still a few years ahead.”
I get restless… It sounds like the band will quit soon. Daniel calms me down.
“no, it’s not like that. I believe there will be at least two more albums. We are still hungry.” It will be interesting to see, whether you and other bands that are popular today, will still play when you are 50. One can perhaps not be as physical then, but it may still be cool to play live etc.
“Yes, but perhaps not with In Flames. It is unfortunate to destroy a good thing like In Flames by being 50 and looking tired and pathetic on stage. So I believe that in some way we will play each on our own. In Flames is an energetic live band, and we shall be associated with that. We shall not be old men, stumbling around on stage. But there are some years ahead before we are that old. In Flames will not exist for so long. There are plenty of examples of old men who has been amazing, who are now making a joke of themselves each time they enter the stage.”
Are you perhaps thinking of Ozzy?
“Yes, among others. It is a bit like being a parody of oneself.”
You are playing the Peace and Love festival in Sweden. Do you feel a connection to the message of the festival, or is it more by chance on your side? Daniel laughs.
“We got an offer which we thought was good, so we said yes. It has nothing to do with the festival in itself.”
creates a positive energy in the listeners
Do you feel the band has a message, something you want to pass on?
“No, we are a completely apolitical band. We exist for people to have fun; coming to the shows and forget the unhappiness and dreariness of everyday life. Not preaching and say what people are supposed to think. That is up to other bands to do. We exist because we think it amazing to play live, and we hope people come and forget their worries for an hour and enjoy themselves.”
You are a very inclusive band. You play in great parts of the world. Some bands are more political, and in that sense they limit their audience. You do not do that.
“No, if you take a political position you sort out people who have other opinions. But I do not believe it has to do with music. It is great that there are environmental activists playing in bands, who get people into right thoughts. But I do not associate it with music. I believe music shall be a refuge from the boring, grey everyday life. There are sufficient stories of problems, climate catastrophes etc, so it can be good to just put on an album, go to a concert, and forget all the sad stuff for a moment. Just having a good time.”
Can perhaps music also be used to actively engage and deal with these problems, and to create change?
“We do not force opinions on people, but we rather create a positive energy in them, more than saying what they shall do. Perhaps that is good enough. I do not say it is wrong to have political messages, but it is not something I feel fits into music so much.”
In Flames will play on the six week long Gigantour in April/May, in North America and Canada. It is a six weeks tour, and the man behind the concept is no other than Dave Mustaine. In Flames share the stage with Megadeth, Children Of Bodom, Job For a Cowboy and High On Fire. All the bands are said to have been picked by Mr. Mustaine himself, among other things by the criteria of the bands having good guitarists. I ask Daniel how true this actually is. Is there not always record labels and other interests involved in such decisions? Daniel seems to think it is quite normal that headlining bands have a great impact on which bands they will bring on their tours.
“When we tour Europe as headliners, we bring bands which we believe will sell tickets. It is not necessarily bands who listen to In Flames, but who will bring even more people to the concerts. It is always like this, there is nothing special about it. Everyone who has their own tour will bring bands to sell more tickets than they could have done on their own. With this tour the perfect combination has been found, to sell many tickets and get a good crossover audience. This lineup is very good, very diverse.”
no underground or mainstream anymore
The lineup also expresses that the boundaries between more extreme forms of metal and more traditional metal, are disappearing.
“Yes, absolutely. I believe this happens with everything, not just music, especially now with the internet. All kinds of culture which is not very mainstream, is still very accessible. At least this is the situation when it comes to music. One does not have to be played on radio to be known. One can be known to the whole world via MySpace. Nothing is extreme anymore. Even though those bands are not played on radio, there are many who know who they are and who listen to their music. Even if it is not on commercial radio or TV. Internet erases the boundaries.”
Do you think In Flames would have been as popular today, if it weren’t for internet and the general development within popular culture?
“No, I do not think so. We are seldom on radio or commercial TV, but we get larger audiences than most of the mainstream artists in Sweden do. We sell more albums than most of them, as well. So it has nothing to do with that. The time where radio and TV decided what people shall listen to, is over. There is no underground or mainstream anymore, I believe.”
You have probably heard it before, but on the last albums I hear some similarities with Korn! Daniel has not heard this before, but says that In Flames has been compared with Linkin Park. I make clear that I do not see similarities with Korn as something negative. I see similarities in terms of the groove, to some extent in terms of the use of sound effects, synths etc, but most of all in the development of Anders’ voice. He has many more facets in his vocals now, in a somewhat similar way to Jonathan Davis. Daniel says that this is not a conscious influence.
“I see Korn as a very good band. They were probably the first to create nu-metal, or however you shall label that genre. And they are the only band in that genre who are still selling records. Limp Bizkit jumped onto that trend, became huge, and then suddenly they disappeared. Korn got a lot of crap because they created a genre which other people jumped on to and copied. People got so tired of nu-metal, but that is not Korn’s problem. We have also never followed trends. We try to develop our music, and develop as musicians, it does not mean that we try to sound like anyone else. I can say as Anders; he wants to develop his instrument, which is his vocal cords. Just screaming straight out in 13 years is not very developing for the voice. He wants to explore his voice, see what dimensions he can add to the music. We had the same intention with all the electronics too – to add something to the music, another dimension, a more interesting sound. But I do not know whether there are similarities with any specific bands. Perhaps that they have tried to create our own path, and we also try to do that.”
Do you agree that you have focused more on groove, more on bass and drums on the latest records than you did previously?
“Yes. Not only bass and drums, but groove in general. On all the first albums, including “Clayman”, In Flames was not a touring band, not very much. The more you tour, the more one notices which songs work well in the live setting. “The Jester Race” is a great album, but there are 100 different guitars, and many of the songs do not fit the live setting. We are a live band, and we want to play the songs the way they are on the album. Therefore we have to adjust the songs when we write them, having in mind how they will work out live. We try to work more with dynamics, so that it is not just full steam ahead all the time. There has to happen different things. Groove, and especially bass and drums, adds a lot of dynamics to a song.”
songs which fit the live-setting
But you toured a good deal with the “Colony” album? Daniel confirms that, but says “not as much”. They did some concerts and did shorter tours with earlier albums too.
“ “Colony” was the album where I joined the band. Prior to that, In Flames was more like a project, where people were coming and going. I was the last one to join when In Flames really became a band. We tried to test how far we could get as a band. Not just record albums, but tour and see how far one can get with an extreme heavy metal band.”
One thing I find interesting, is that while you guys have become older, you are now appealing to an even younger fanbase than earlier. Do you agree?
“I do not know. But there is an obvious generational change. Many of those who listened to In Flames 10-12 years ago may buy the albums, but they are no longer coming to the concerts. There is a great difference when we look at the audience, and compare it to ten years ago. There are very few people with leatherjackets and long hair which are looking towoards the floor while we are playing. Now there are many “ordinary” boys and girls, often teenagers. Many ages are represented, but I believe the majority are in their late teens. I do not know why. There is a clear generational change in the metal audience.”
Does it have anything to do with emotional needs in humanity? The music has perhaps a greater appeal because many need to vent their emotions in a different way, by going to concerts?
“No, I do not think so. There are still many metal bands, but there are few which have such a big and ordinary audience as us – average Joe’s – you could say. I do not know why it is so, other than us being a very good band.”
But it seems that extreme music now is much more accessible, and has a great mainstream appeal. What is the reason? Is it something emotional in the listeners, which makes them feel drawn towards the music?
“No, as I said earlier, many people who thought metal was just noise and screaming, or perhaps did not even know the music existed, has got the chance to listen to it. Previously people were watching MTV and listening to radio, and there you only hear the same music over and over again. There is a lot of other good music out there, which one can discover. The youth is on MySpace etc, that is where the music is nowadays.”
Daniel takes a pause, before he acknowledges the possibility of people also needing to give vent to aggression.
“That is just speculation. But the music gives a good opportunity for that, at least.”
But in a good way. One may say the music is aggressive, but one can also say it is energetic. That is more positive.
“Yes, it is a definition. We are not aggressive as persons. Energetic is actually a better word. Aggressive does not fit so well”, he says, and I add that I also sense joy in the music. “Hatebreed is more aggressive in that case.”
skilled, destructive drummers
Which qualities are important for you as a drummer?
” To keep an ordinary groove. To know when to let go a little, and when to be more visible and go for it. To be musical, to understand how a song can sound different, without playing it apart, but still get in small nuances so that it can be refined. There are many skilled drummers who destroys songs by showing how amazing drummers they are. They play all the drums at the same time, fast. “How many 32th notes can I play in this fill?” Then they destroy the song completely.”
He believes there is a thin line between holding a steady groove, and adding a new dimension to songs with details and technique.
“When you are younger and play drums, you often want to show in every fill how good a drummer you are, without thinking about what consequences it has for the song. It is hard.
One the earlier albums, there was a lot of polka, I say. Daniel does not understand what I mean by polka in this context. I describe it as quick alternation between bassdrum and snare. “yeah, two/four”, Daniel says. Now the drumming has more nuances, I claim.
”I haven’t thought about it. We do quite a lot of 2/4 on this album. It depends on the guitar riffs. I love 2/4. Listen to “Slaughter Of The Soul”, it is two/four during the whole album, more or less. But it depends on the riff.”
This interview was done in Swedish/Norwegian, and we discuss what the correct term would be in English. I have chosen to translate the name of this particular “drum beat” as two/four (some people say “one-two”), and I believe it is actually more or less the same as what is played in polka, which is played in two/four, but it is faster. In Flames used this quite a lot in the earlier material, perhaps on “Whoracle” especially. Interesting to note is that I believe it is not used at all on “Colony”, an album which stands out as a quite different album musically. I believe it is perhaps also their best album. Daniel explains that it is hard for him to be interviewed by drum magazines, because he does not know the proper terms in English.
Will you ever do something slightly strange, such as using ballet dancers on stage (which Entombed has done), violin on stage (he says njaaaa)…. Or acoustic songs?
“We have spoken about doing an acoustic set. We have songs which we believe we could rearrange and play acoustically. But we will have to see in which form it would fit to do it, and when and how. It must not be bad. We do not want to do anything which is not very good. We will see. It is better not to do it, than to do it mediocre.”
Will you re-record some of the old songs? Give them a better and more modern production?
“No, I do not think so. Because they represent In Flames and how we sounded then. So there is not really any reason to record them again, because that is not how we sound today.”
Daniel then says something which I interpret in the sense that rerecording the old songs would be to play with history, and try to better it.
“That was how In Flames sounded then, it is just to accept it. When we released it, it was because it was good. We have never released anything we have not felt content with. But when one goes back, one sees that things could have been done differently etc. We stand for everything we have released. I do not think we will rerecord any old songs.”
Anders’ psychological interest
Daniel says he has been asked few direct questions about the new songs. I ask if Anders reads spiritual literature, which Daniel disproves. In the song “I’m The Highway” Anders sings something like “I am staring into truth, existence care for me”. Previously he has been singing about having dialogues with the stars and so on, as well as things like “I am at one with the world tonight”. At the “Whoracle” album there is at least one direct reference to “chaos theory”, about how the flap of a butterfly wing can alter the direction of evolution. Many of these things could fit into the modern spiritual literature. Anders also displays a search for meaning and purpose, and he often expresses himself in a poetical manner.
”He writes in metaphors, about everyday things. He is no bookworm. He works quite a bit with metaphors, but the lyrics are about ordinary matters. They are written in such a way that they are open for interpretation. It is not black and white, one has to read between the lines.”
So he often uses his own everyday life as his point of departure?
“Yes, to some extent, and he is studying other people, what he believe they are doing.”
Daniel admits that Anders has an interest in psychology, and that this also is reflected in the title – “A Sense Of Purpose”. In the song “Alias” Anders sings “Don’t tell me, tell my ghost”. And he uses the term shadow in several of his lyrics, which I believe can refer to the unconscious. He also uses the term “mask”, which I believe is meant in a psychological sense. It can easily be interpreted in the sense that he has read about these things.
“No, I don’t think he has done that. It is more that he questions life. What is the purpose? Are we all just ants in an ant hill? Should we wake up seven in the morning, become stressed in getting to work in time, work, have more stress, pick up the children in kindergarten, go home to make dinner and get the children to bed, and then the whole thing is repeated the next day – up again, like an ant, seven o’clock. Is this the purpose? What happened? This is not how things were meant to be in the first place. One has to stop and reflect. Who has set the norm for what is considered normal and what one should do? Everyone is going on a track, without stopping for a while to reflect.”
This may not necessary be political, but it can easily be labeled social criticism.
“Yes, apolitical social criticism.”
And it appears that Anders requests more humanity in society?
“Yes, exactly. We live like robots, in a “queue”-society. Follow the leader, do as you should do. But one does not really know why. You are not allowed to be abnormal, you should be like everyone else. Everyone should be the same.
Would you say that the band thus represents freedom? Freedom can be something you want to communicate, in an apolitical sense?
“Yes, exactly. How free are we, if we think about it? How free are we really, in the western world, we who are forced to work so much etc? We see ourselves as free, but perhaps it is we who are the greatest slaves, slaves under ourselves. I have been thinking about this – perhaps you should move with your family, and start a self-sufficient farm. Grow your own food, forget about all authorities and what one “must” do, and see how things were meant to work. Today there is mass hysteria, you should have a career etc. You do not really meet anymore, have little social relations except in the workplace. If you look at how long the earth has existed, and see the time perspective since industrialism and now – it is not even one thousandth of how long humans has existed on this earth. And we will exterminate ourselves”, the Swede ends.
www.inflames.com
www.myspace.com/inflames
www.nuclearblast.de
www.indiedist.no
Composed by Andreas Aubert